Kagama Kagama 6S - Servo issues after 2 packs

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dannyboy

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Corally RC's
  1. Kagama
Hi guys, I'm new to Corrally and new to big 6S rigs. I did however, buy a 6s Kagama based on the amazing reviews everywhere I looked. Unfortunately the servo "packed up working" after a couple of packs. I haven't changed the B.E.C. to run on higher voltage but I do not think that's the issue. I think the servo isn't capable of powering the steering of the car!
Has anyone else had the same issue?
How do I report this to Corrally?
Do they accept the issue they have with this servo? - it's not just me is it?
Can they help in anyway?

Thanks guys - newbee -
Dan
 
Stock servo are junk unfortunately, corally have good customer support they will replace but it will probably go the same way after a while. I recommend upgrading it a bit disappointing to have to do so on a new rig but it is what it is.
Just drop corally a message they will sort you out no doubt with a new one they sometimes offer an upgrade. Depends on your budget but I use agfrc servos if looking for an upgrade.

https://support.corally.com/hc/en-us
 
Stock servo are junk unfortunately, corally have good customer support they will replace but it will probably go the same way after a while. I recommend upgrading it a bit disappointing to have to do so on a new rig but it is what it is.
Just drop corally a message they will sort you out no doubt with a new one they sometimes offer an upgrade. Depends on your budget but I use agfrc servos if looking for an upgrade.

https://support.corally.com/hc/en-us
Ahh mate, thanks for the help, genuinely appreciated. I will contact them directly.
Thank you once again,
Dan
 
Stock servo are junk unfortunately, corally have good customer support they will replace but it will probably go the same way after a while. I recommend upgrading it a bit disappointing to have to do so on a new rig but it is what it is.
Just drop corally a message they will sort you out no doubt with a new one they sometimes offer an upgrade. Depends on your budget but I use agfrc servos if looking for an upgrade.

https://support.corally.com/hc/en-us
Thank you for the response mate 👍🏻
 
IDK why, but I have had the least success with TC servos. I’m talking strictly RTR. I imagine the servos they sell are better. The RTR servo in the 6s rigs performs fine, just didn’t last. I went through 2, my brother cooked 3. All in short order.
By comparison, he loves his Spektrum RTR servos, and we’ve both had better results from TRX standard servos than the TC units.
Exception being the Sledge, that servo sucked balls too. My UDR servo is quite weak also, but hasn’t given up yet.
You can buy a $30 servo that will easily outlive the stock TC servo, but maybe a tad slower. Or, spend $50 and have more speed, torque and longevity.
I know many go even higher in the range of $100, but IMO just not worth it.
Depends on your budget I suppose.
 
Not 6's but my Punisher 4 after about 15 ish packs just got a new servo HobbyStar. Old one wouldnt stay centered and had mad excessive slop. I did contact Corally and they sent out a new servo within a week. Some the best customer service.

Go to their site and look for warranty claims. pretty simple. They ask for model type and a receipt etc....
 
IDK why, but I have had the least success with TC servos. I’m talking strictly RTR. I imagine the servos they sell are better. The RTR servo in the 6s rigs performs fine, just didn’t last. I went through 2, my brother cooked 3. All in short order.
By comparison, he loves his Spektrum RTR servos, and we’ve both had better results from TRX standard servos than the TC units.
Exception being the Sledge, that servo sucked balls too. My UDR servo is quite weak also, but hasn’t given up yet.
You can buy a $30 servo that will easily outlive the stock TC servo, but maybe a tad slower. Or, spend $50 and have more speed, torque and longevity.
I know many go even higher in the range of $100, but IMO just not worth it.
Depends on your budget I suppose.
I bought two of their €80, 60kg servos. They both died within one season. Most of my €20 DS servos and one 9Imod last longer.
 
The upgraded servo they sent me for my Kagama LE has been good for about a dozen hours of use in my spark. Still, point taken, they are not great. I run AGFRC and Ipin servos in my maxx slash and LE respectively. The former is brushed and the latter brushless helical gears. They both develop a bit of slop but otherwise still function well for a basher.

Best option is buy your own aftermarket servo for primary use. Keep the warranty servo as a backup.
 
Hi guys, I'm new to Corrally and new to big 6S rigs. I did however, buy a 6s Kagama based on the amazing reviews everywhere I looked. Unfortunately the servo "packed up working" after a couple of packs. I haven't changed the B.E.C. to run on higher voltage but I do not think that's the issue. I think the servo isn't capable of powering the steering of the car!
Has anyone else had the same issue?
How do I report this to Corrally?
Do they accept the issue they have with this servo? - it's not just me is it?
Can they help in anyway?

Thanks guys - newbee -
Dan
Standard RTR servo drama. Magic smoke has been released! 😜

You are not alone. It's a bad omen to talk about RTR servos here! A bit like trying to play 'stairway to heaven' in a guitar shop. Don't do it!! 😝

You can ask Corally and try and get it replaced under warranty.

Or....you can replace it with a decent, brushless aftermarket servo. 💪

PXL_20240923_171359926.webp
 
Standard RTR servo drama. Magic smoke has been released! 😜

You are not alone. It's a bad omen to talk about RTR servos here! A bit like trying to play 'stairway to heaven' in a guitar shop. Don't do it!! 😝

You can ask Corally and try and get it replaced under warranty.

Or....you can replace it with a decent, brushless aftermarket servo. 💪

View attachment 10991
There are those in the helicopter world that swear by coreless servos because the lower rotational mass of the coreless motor is mutch less than that of a brushless motor which makes the servo accelerate and decelerate quicker. They are not wrong the rotor in a coreless motor is a lightweight hollow basket of fine copper wire while the rotor of a brushless servo motor is a solid two pole neodymium magnet. You can see the difference side by side of two otherwise identical speed servos, the coreless one will accelerate from a stop and decelerate to a stop faster than the brushless one even though the transit time is the same.

Whether anyone can tell the difference is debatable but then I also can't fly a helicopter like this either so I'm not a good judge:
 
There was a time that coreless servos were considered the premium option for servos. They certainly spool up quickly, compared to the (much older) iron armature servos.

However, both cored and coreless servos are both brushed motor designs, which degrade over time and are generally less powerful.

Whilst coreless motors spool up quickly, modern brushless servos are more efficient, quieter and more powerful - often able to run at higher voltages.

Essentially any spool up disadvantage that may once have existed between them is mitigated by the servos gearing design.

60° /0.06 sec is faster than anyone could ever need.

Brushless servos are ideal for surface vehicles, which are more prone to shocks and impacts than aircraft or helicopters.
 
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Brushed motors also need to overcome the friction of the brushes, which will slow their acceleration. Brushed also have less power than a brushed motor.

Brushless motors need to find their position in one of two possible configurations, aka cogging before they can even begin accelerating.
 
Brushless servos are ideal for surface vehicles, which are more prone to shocks and impacts than aircraft or helicopters.
You underestimate helicopters, they vibrate, no mater what they vibrate. Even a perfectly balanced heli rotor will vibrate and this is normal, it is because lead-lag and blade flapping forces as well as cyclic control of the blade pitch are cyclical and asymmetrical. The advancing blade leads, the retreating blade lags, the advancing blade tries to flap up, the retreating blade tries to flap down, cyclic pitch applies asymmetrical angle of attack as the blade rotates around the mast so that AOA is less on one side of the rotor disk than the other. All these things cause the helicopter to vibrate at the fundamental frequency of the main and tail rotor RPM as well as their harmonic frequencies. It is severe enough that helicopter servos must have silicone goop or epoxy applied to any flying leads inside the servo case else they will eventually just fall off the PCB due to gradual weakening of the solder joint caused by the wires vibrating while the ends are fixed. Think a coat hanger bent back and forth multiple times till it breaks, that's what happens to the wire at the solder joint. If the steering servo on a car fails it might survive if you're fast on the throttle, if the cyclic servo or tail servo on a helicopter fails it makes a trough and surrounding debris field.
 
Brushed motors also need to overcome the friction of the brushes, which will slow their acceleration. Brushed also have less power than a brushed motor.

Brushless motors need to find their position in one of two possible configurations, aka cogging before they can even begin accelerating.
Brushless servo motors are sensored usually two pole inrunners, 4 poles is only used in very expensive high end servos. The motor is a copper wire basket with three phases glued inside an iron tube and the rotor in a solid cylindrical neodymium magnet with a pin through it that rotates on brass bushings. On the end is a small round PCB with three hall effect sensors in a triangle around the end of the rotor that tells the servo electronics what angle the magnet is at. There are usually 7 pins on the end of the motor and it is soldered directly to the PCB. three pins are the motor phases and the other 5 are +/- and the three sense lines for the hall sensors. Sometimes the motor has only three phase pins and a 5 wire ribbon cable with a JST SH connector or board-in solderable connector for the hall sensors but the 7 pin direct solder configuration is most common.

EDIT A "board-in" connector is a connector that is crimped onto a lead and has solder pins so that it may be soldered to a PCB. It's used to avoid the fragility issues with solder joints on delicate wires.
 
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Took me a minute to dig up the pics I took all those years ago. The servo was dead already so I did a teardown of the motor.

brushless_servo_motor_001.webp


brushless_servo_motor_002.webp


brushless_servo_motor_003.webp


brushless_servo_motor_004.webp


brushless_servo_motor_005.webp


brushless_servo_motor_006.webp
 
You underestimate helicopters, they vibrate, no mater what they vibrate.

Yep, I get it. Cyclic / swash plates = resulting cyclic vibrations. Vibrations can be a major issue in all model types - especially those with large, single cylinder IC engines (regardless of vehicle type).

I've built just 4 helicopters (all proper 6 channel types) over the years - 2 Raptor 60 nitro powered things and 2 electric lipo powered mini helicopters, which I used to fly indoors (inside a leisure centre). One of them I actually still own (it's in a box in my garage somewhere). However, I've had an opportunity over the years to 'operate' some very interesting flying machines. 😜

Back to the case in point - Coreless V Brushless.

I think any perceived performance advantage with coreless servos is now overcome by brushless servos with their increased efficiency, higher power/torque output and longer life.

The death of servos often comes about as combination of zero isolation, incorrect end points, high voltage and excessive shock loads.

The latter would only really occur in a helicopter if it struck terrain, in which case we would normally attribute that to pilot error, rather than servo failure. 🤭

Generally, we see people on this forum burning up RTR servos. These servos are invariably cheaper, coreless, digital servos.

Upgrade to just about any modern brushless servo - and the issues tend to go away.

I'm a firm believer in buying quality servos. The difference is perceivable, especially when you are timed racing around on a twisty carpet track. Likewise, you can definitely get used to a 'connected', low latency system and fast (quicker than 60°/0.08s) servos.

Consequently, I am now dependent on 'feeling' what my rigs are doing and the quality of both the radio link and the output of motion are the only way to ensure that 'feel' is maintained across my multiple different platforms.

As you yourself use Express LRS, and I TBS Crossfire (for a/c & FPV drones) & FASST for all my surface stuff, it's really easy to take this level of connection for granted.

I recently tried a bog standard, 2.4ghz RTR pistol grip radio for a TT01. It was laggy and required putting inputs in noticeably ahead of time to avoid constantly hitting the markings.

It's fine for ripping around outside in a parking lot, not so much for threading the eye of the needle in a busy heat!

Again, through preference, I really can't stand Pistol radios. Probably because I have developed strong memory muscle with stick radios over the years since I was 8, but also because they are counter intuitive with my aircraft radios. Opposable thumbs rule!
 
Took me a minute to dig up the pics I took all those years ago. The servo was dead already so I did a teardown of the motor.

View attachment 11035

View attachment 11036

View attachment 11037

View attachment 11038

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View attachment 11040
Great info. I had just assumed they had no positioning circuitry due to, well the price. I guess I should not have assumed.

I really like the one brushless servo I have used. I like it enough I bought a second, but my other servos have yet to die.
 
Great info. I had just assumed they had no positioning circuitry due to, well the price. I guess I should not have assumed.

I really like the one brushless servo I have used. I like it enough I bought a second, but my other servos have yet to die.
All my car servos since 2019 have been brushless, except for the Savox servo in my Baja 5B which is coreless. It's also far and away the noisiest servo ever. You could wake the dead with it. 🤭

Protek 170 SBL & TBL (5)
AGF 81BHMW (2)
AGF B53BHPW (1)
AGF A62BHS (1) - Low profile servo

I will almost certainly be getting another A62BHS for the B7 Team.

All servos have positioning sensors, otherwise they wouldn't be able to know end points or centres. Older servos have potentiometers.

Newer ones have 'magnetic' hall effect sensors which are much better.
 
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